Watch Kimi cock it up and give Magnussen a penalty

"Bakkster, touring car driver" (Bakkster) 03/31/2014 at 07:35 • Filed to: None

1

35

Pretty lame of the iceman here.

McMike > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 07:44

3

I thought it was a racing incident. Shit happens.

Then they handed the penalty to Magnussen, and I was like WTF???

Gabor Vajda (@Gabor_V) > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 07:46

2

This was a plain racing incident, Kimi wanted to cut Magnussen off, coming back from the outside, whereas Mag. already had the racing line. Kimi punished himself for doing something less than careful and I have no idea how they got Kevin at fault.

davedave1111 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 07:49

0

Kimi did nothing wrong there. Magnussen didn't do a lot wrong, just misjudged the position of his front wing slightly, but it did ruin Kimi's race so arguably deserved a penalty.

Anima > McMike 03/31/2014 at 08:06

0

Yeah I agree. I have a feeling we might see a LOT of 5 sec penalties this year.

Just as a 'See, we did something about it so you don't come complaining to me later.' excuse.
Because it is easier for the FIA to say: 'We made our decision' than it is to deal with teams complaining for actions they didn't take.

IMO Kimi went a bit wider than he wanted but had the corner, Magnussen misjudged his distance.

But hey, that may just be my half-empty kinda view on this, let's see how it works out over the season.

Andy Sheehan, StreetsideStig > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 08:26

0

Yeah, I didn't agree with that call. NOT ONE BIT.

tomtom615 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 08:28

0

That's why they call him "Iceman" and not "Niceman"

davedave1111 > Anima 03/31/2014 at 08:33

0

I'm pretty sure we'll see a fair few of the new penalties applied this year, because they're filling a wide gap between no-penalty and too-much-penalty. The stewards finally have something suitable for punishing minor infractions as well as major ones.

Bakkster, touring car driver > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 08:36

0

Well, it ruined Kevin's race, too. Did Kevin misjudge his front wing, or did Kimi presume he had more room he had to come back across the track after his error? It was a racing deal, which is why it's BS Mags got a penalty and Kimi's whining about how Kevin ruined his race instead of taking responsibility for his initially going wide.

davedave1111 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 08:46

2

It's not Kimi's responsibility to give room to a car he can't see, and which isn't alongside him. Magnussen obviously didn't mean to go into the gap which was always going to close, but his car was a few inches ahead of where he thought it was relative to Kimi.

I don't think Kimi did anything out of the ordinary, except he got a bit of wiggle as he tried to get back on the power. Maybe that slowed him up slightly, and that's why Magnussen ended up where he did.

Magnussen also didn't do much, so like I said, I can see why people might think his penalty was harsh. But it's clear to me that of the two of them he was the wronger, since Kimi did nothing wrong at all. If Magnussen'd barged up the inside and t-boned Kimi, it would clearly be his fault. This is much the same in principle, only he didn't go as far and the consequences weren't as serious.

At the end of the day, although Magnussen didn't appear to do it on purpose, he was somewhere he shouldn't have been, and that did impede another car. It was literally a rookie error, and it was punished with the most minor penalty the stewards have available (I think).

Plus, of course, Kimi's driving for Ferrari now. Everyone knows it's an offence to hit a Ferrari... ;)

FrederickLawOlmsteez > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 09:14

0

If Kimi didn't cut a tire, there would have been no penalty. The penalty was just a way to even the score.

FrederickLawOlmsteez > Gabor Vajda (@Gabor_V) 03/31/2014 at 09:17

0

Mags was ON the line, but he did not "have" it — not from that far back! Kimi was just trying to get back on the line.

Gabor Vajda (@Gabor_V) > FrederickLawOlmsteez 03/31/2014 at 09:20

0

He could've stayed on the left and have the line for the left turn. I think he misjudged the distance between them.

pirates-ecu > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 09:27

0

watch it again, mag is already on the right for a few seconds before the crash. Hes all the way against the curb, kimi swings SUPER wide for corner entry, and smacks into mag.... nothing he could do.

that was a stupid ass penalty. \

pirates-ecu > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 09:29

0

watch it again, kimi holds wide, wide wide, then slams all the way to the right, its all kimis fault..

before you start, im both a McLaren, and a iceman fan

Anima > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 09:30

0

On the one hand I am happy that there is a midway now like you say. However I'm affraid that it might be used too quickly. But only time will tell.

Gabor Vajda (@Gabor_V) > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 09:31

0

Thinking about it, taking the simple rule of thumb in traffic, the car behind is at fault most of the time. So Kimi may or may not have seen Mags coming there. But is it mandatory to leave such a space between the two cars that the one in front can come back undisturbed when made a mistake?

I mean, it's called 'racing' for a reason.

davedave1111 > pirates-ecu 03/31/2014 at 09:37

0

Kimi's allowed to go there, though. It's Magnussen's responsibility to stay out of the way. It's only once he's 'alongside' that Kimi has to leave him room.

The line Kimi took isn't at all unreasonable, because the corner doesn't occur in isolation: he was setting up for the next corner, as well as oversteering.

davedave1111 > pirates-ecu 03/31/2014 at 09:37

0

Again, Kimi's allowed to do that.

pirates-ecu > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 09:44

1

their is a regulation stating that drivers must leave the other driver space at the edge of the track. kimi took away that space and sucked himself into mag.


I would have called it a racing incident, but im not a drivers steward./

davedave1111 > pirates-ecu 03/31/2014 at 09:47

0

No, that reg only applies if the other driver is alongside. Magnussen was behind. Kimi couldn't have seen exactly where he was, so it was Magnussen's responsibility to avoid the incident.

As I said, though, I also think it was, at most, only just the wrong side of the line from 'racing incident'. But Kimi was in a Ferrari, so...

2BWise > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 09:49

0

I agree with you on this one. Kimi would not have expected Magnussen to try and go underneath him there and from so far back. Magnussen just got a bit too close. I'm sure he wasn't expecting to pass there as it would have done no good, but I bet he was trying to setup the exit for the following turn.

tromoly > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 12:02

0

Magnussen held his line on the extreme right-side of the corner at a constant pace, it is no his fault Kimi came back over to the right.

Kimi came back over to the right thinking he had clear air, granted he slowed down due to stepping out but it is not his fault he lost speed and the gap shrank.

It was a racing accident, due to seating position Magnussen could not see his front wing (it's been gone over before, nothing new) to ensure he would be clear, and due to seating position Kimi could not see the other car properly in his mirrors to ensure he had a proper gap.

Bakkster, touring car driver > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 12:11

0

The last line is the long and short of it. Kimi's in a Ferrari, anything that happens to a Ferrari is the other guy's fault (unless a Ferrari driver criticizes the car).

Bakkster, touring car driver > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 12:14

0

Not according to the rules. Kimi brought his wheel sideways into Mag's wing.

20.4 Any driver defending his position on a straight, and before any braking area, may use the full width of the track during his first move, provided no significant portion of the car attempting to pass is alongside his. Whilst defending in this way the driver may not leave the track without justifiable reason. For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion' .

Kimi should have left space, Mags was alongside by definition.

Bakkster, touring car driver > FrederickLawOlmsteez 03/31/2014 at 12:22

0

Yes he did. In F1, a car is considered alongside as soon as the front wing is alongside the rear tire. Kimi lost the line when the tail stepped out and left enough of a gap that Mags was considered to have a 'significant portion' of his car alongside.

Bakkster, touring car driver > FrederickLawOlmsteez 03/31/2014 at 12:23

0

Magnussen's front wing was wrecked, the score seemed pretty even to me, especially since it wasn't really his fault.

Icemanmaybeirunoutofthetalents > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 14:37

0

There wasn't enough room there for KMag. Rookie mistake. The next turn was right there and Kimi was ahead and Kmag didn't move. Ruined both their races.

Bakkster, touring car driver > Icemanmaybeirunoutofthetalents 03/31/2014 at 15:04

0

What do you mean there wasn't room? The track is at least 8 car widths everywhere, and slow corners like that are easy to go two wide. Mags left as much room as he would ever need to. Kimi could have used the other 7 lanes of the track without encroaching into Magnussen's.

Kimi was ahead, but by F1 rules Magnussen was considered alongside since his front wing reached Kimi's rear tire. I might agree that it wasn't the wisest move, but the FIA shouldn't be penalizing Kevin for that. He had a right to be there even if the smart move would have been to back out.

davedave1111 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 22:48

0

Ferrari International Assistance? It's mostly a joke :)

davedave1111 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 22:51

0

I stand corrected, thanks. I really need to read those rules properly. Do you have a link?

I'm dumbfounded by that portion you've bolded. Maybe the stewards were as well. How the hell was Kimi supposed to know where Magnussen was?

To be clear, I'm now fully convinced the penalty on Magnussen was either very harsh or for something else covered under another rule. But the rule you quoted seems bizarrely difficult to defend against as the driver in front.

Bakkster, touring car driver > davedave1111 03/31/2014 at 22:52

0

I'm aware, but I'm just baffled why else Magnussen got penalized for a racing deal.

davedave1111 > tromoly 03/31/2014 at 22:53

0

I've been corrected on the rules: apparently Kimi wasn't entitled to move over. So it was his fault. So forget it being a rookie error: it was an error an experienced driver could make. I'm still happy with 'racing incident'.

davedave1111 > 2BWise 03/31/2014 at 22:54

0

Without changing what we're agreeing on, I've been told I had the rules wrong: Kimi wasn't allowed to move over - so the same argument applies, but the other way around.

davedave1111 > Bakkster, touring car driver 03/31/2014 at 22:58

0

Well, leaving the rules-as-written aside for a minute, it all seems about right to me. The rookie Magnussen needs to learn to give people a little more space in racing situations now he's in F1. He got a minor kick to help him learn.

Penalty or not, I'm sure he'll have learnt not to follow quite so close next time.

Bakkster, touring car driver > davedave1111 04/01/2014 at 07:23

1

Absolutely, there's a difference between having a right to the line and it being a good idea to take. The issue is only that Mags didn't deserve a penalty. Getting his wing chopped off was punishment enough.